sanding the die is really just lapping the die. the important bits are the inside and you're not sanding down to the internals (and if you do then you goofed).

Silicon Lottery said delidding and sanding the die was usually only good for 3-7c on average for Coffee Lake but AFAIK that's with re-lidding afterwards.

is 7c lower temps going to get you to clocks that you couldn't get to previously? if yes, then lap. if no, then don't.

 

I know someone who removed 65% of the die (silicon nitrate). He did it for a Clevo LGAbook install, along with a custom machined IHS (lower Z-height). He had the die height lower than an 8700K's die. Worked fine and more than 20C temp drop. He was not using direct die however.

I would NOT sand the die unless you actually KNOW you want to sand the die or need to know you want to sand the die.
Delidding and using the rockit cool direct die frame is good enough. Hell, you can just delid and use the rockit cool copper IHS. That's enough. Or buy the tuning plan, delid, sand the IHS flat, reseal.

The reason why you don't want to sand the die when you use a direct die frame is, the rockitcool frame is designed for default die height. If you sand the die, you also have to sand the frame to compensate.
Don't buy the Der8auer frame. Only people who hate themselves buy the Der8auer frame.

Sanding the Intel IHS flat will give you a good improvement also. However you can kiss your primary warranty goodbye. I do *NOT* know if Intel will still do their advanced tuning plan on sanded IHS's. I know nothing about stock IHS's that were delidded and resealed pristine for the primary warranty, but they will accept the tuning plan for delidded processors that are relidded first, but a sanded IHS...um...you will have to ask someone else about that. There was absolutely nothing on their website that said that you can't sand the IHS and still do their replacement tuning plan, and since nothing says you can't, they would have to honor a replacement if it died from too much voltage. To be honest, you would have a similar issue if you used LM on the intel IHS and it wore out the etching. GG normal warranty, Tuning plan should still cover that. If you care about your warranty, use the rockitcool IHS.

Here's some advice for you.
If you DO want to sand the die, buy some pressure paper so you can do a dry mount BEFORE Sanding anything to check for pressure and balance.

https://www.amazon.com/Innovation-Cooling-Contact-Analysis-Heatsink/dp/B07CKHRKHQ/
If you're cheap, you can get a free sample from sensorprod (ask for Fujifilm Ultra Low Prescale). They DO give free samples, but you have to be very polite about it. And then they want you to buy more ($$$$$).

 

Hi,
You'd be flushing a intel 3 year warranty down the drain.
Beside that not really soldered and all you have a 50-50% chance of damaging the die.

 

To me it was worth it. I actually just delided direct die cooling on mine and saw a 15c+ reduction with liquid metal. If I recall correctly my temps were 90c-95c on 5.1Ghz 1.32v LL6 Cinebench R20, same settings delided I get 78C tops.

If you’re going to delid just go all out and direct die. But that’s just me I like to squeeze every potential I can from my products. I can do 5.2Ghz but voltage becomes a problem at 1.45v LLC5 171AMPS and a reputable source told me that’s too high for daily use. Temps top at 85C.

 

Who might that reputable source be?

 

Lol! I dont recall giving you a +Rep for that advice. Anyway +Rep.

 

for me delidding my i9 9900kf I went down 6c from 93 to 87 under full load. and now I went direct die with rocket tool and temps never go above 82c so I gained another 5c with direct die, not bad for a 11c drop and temps don't creep up anymore. the vrms get hotter then the cpu now so yes its worth it.

 

Can the Rockit88 be used for a 9900K or is the 89 a def requirement?

 

Anyone?

 

The Silicon Lottery service for delidding means they'll do so and guarantee they won't mess up your CPU? If they delid it, does that mean your CPU is ready for a rockit cool direct die frame install? Will the rockit cool direct die frame make any diff. with high end air coolers like the DH-15 or the Le Gran Macho?

 

they won't delid and leave it naked, their delidding service has to be re-lidded.

at least that was their response to me a year ago when I asked.

 

If they relid the CPU what's the point in offering a delidding service at all?

 

Hi,
Silicon lottery sealant is a lot easier to open up than braking a soldered chip apart
All you need is a couple razor blades

 

I’ve delidded 4 9900k and all of them produced a 8c to 10c drop it temps with a copper ihs. Has anyone has better results with stock ihs. I think it has to be sanded down to fit again properly but I’ve never had the patience. Tried direct die with the Der8auer Intel 9th Gen OC Frame and my cpu got damaged from to much pressure wouldn’t try that again.

 

I've lapped a cpu in the past and will probably lap my cpu die unless I get the rockit kit thing with the bigger pre lapped die but

I saw a YouTube video of someone delidding a 9900k then he scraped off the solder interface, then he lapped the actual silicon on the chip, and I'm wondering how that could possibly be safe. He claimed to get like something like 15C cooler off of it. He removed like a quarter of the silicon on the chip

What I'm wondering is would this be detrimental to the cpu in ways you can't really notice with a stress test? Why would Intel make the chip way thicker than normal? Apparently the thermal conductivity of silicon is much lower than copper and the claim was that going through that fraction of a millimeter of the chip is the main reason why Temps can't be controlled on the 9900k even with the best aio there is. Personally I hate aio coolers and tried one and a 240 rad won't even bolt to my spec 02 case so I'm gunna get a dark rock pro 4 or a noctua d15 chromax. By the way are those perfectly flat and true on the bottom or should they be lapped too?

I'm 100 percent going to have a lapped cpu even to get 2C out of itbecause that makes the noctua keep up with the best watercooling there is even though I know the reason people lap is for liquid nitrogen and the fact it cracks the thermal compound from convexing

But yeah is it worth it to rip my IHS off my cpu, then scrape off the solder then sand a quarter of the silicon off my chip? I wanna overclock my 9900k and it's stock for now til I pick my best thermal solution but it seems like even the best coolers in the world can end up near 100c on these chips and honestly short of trading my Intel mobo and cpu for an AMD thatcan be tamed I don't know what to do about this


Edit: I read up somewhere on reddit and someone was talking about the equation of thermal conductivity of the chip and claimed the cpu would have to produce something like a 900 watt TDP to even have that little bit of silicon sanded down matter to drop the Temps 15C, if that's the case would delidding and liquid metal work almost as s good as sanding the chip?

You can get the delid tool for cheap and delid it. But your taking a risk, just like when you take off your stock video card fans and change it to something more exotic. There is always a chance of a crack on the CPU but if you do it properly and look at some utube videos then you will know how to do it. Then you would put liquid metal on the die and close her up. Your Temps will be 2 to 5c less. More like avg 3c but also your warmest temps will come down couple degrees. You have a nice processor I wouldn't touch it if it was me. Just not worth it... You spin the screw on the delid tool with agression and say goodbye to your CPU and what not.

 

If you use the proper Delid kit and you damage the CPU Rockit will replace it. You'll have to send in the CPU for them to confirm that's what broke it but really it's so damn easy to do, you shouldn't run into any problems.

For me going deliidding and going direct I went from close to 100c at 5ghz to at max 64c. It was well worth it.

With how hot these Intel CPU's are getting, IMHO delid and direct die is the way to go. I also can't say enough good things about Rockit's direct die kit, works wonders

 

Might do direct die but I just put a monoblock on my board...lol Would have to disassemble everything to get to it now

 

Just be careful man I mean anyone can do it with the delid tool and a video showing how to do it. I personaly wouldn't take a chance on chipping the CPU and with my luck that would happen and know your clusterfudghed.

 

Thanks but I'm sure I'll be fine. I started delidding when the go to tool was just a razor blade..lol

However I'll be buying the complete direct die set which comes with the new tool. Perhaps I'll put it on tour here like I did with the Rockit 88 a while back.

 

I went ahead and ordered the whole kit for the 9900k. I figured since I have a pretty good clocker the extra temp headroom will help for benchmarking.

 

Thanks for the awesome advice guys

I think i'll start off by water-cooling with a custom loop, and then I'll see where my temps are at. I has a 2070 super which I can only get +1100mhz memory clock and 100mhz core atm and gets to 80C during benchmarking so I'm hoping that a full custom loop will help me get more GPU headroom as well. the 9900k thermally throttles like a mofo and honestly my air cooler aint too good for it but I don't wanna waste money on something else to get me by until I get a waterloop in. It's been about 5 years since I uilt a waterloop and I decided soft black rubber tubing is the way to go for me without all those stupid RGB parts.

So I'm gunna have to get a lian li dynamic o11D case soon which is like 140-200 depending on if I want the XL or not, but theres a craigslist add for a non XL for 75 I might pick out. currently trying to decide on the waterblock for GPU I guess a corsair is going to have to do because I hate the look of the bitspower lotan and microcenter only has that for 2080FE version sadly

I got both a D5 and DDC from a friend and two EKWB 5 year old cpu blocks I gotta clean up, I think he burned out the DDC and the D5 mighjt be okay im hoping, gotta hooke a PSU up to them and see if they run later haha, he might give me a radiator as well, I think a 240 would be fine for my GPU and I want a 360 for sure for my cpu.

if I can get a little more headroom with just a waterloop, I might hold off on the delidding for quite a while, just pisses me off how hard this cpu is to cool haha but step 1 is getting water-cooling to work. funny thing is direct die with a 50 dollar air cooler might be just as good but honestly the idea of messing up a $500 chip scares me enough to try water-cooling first lol

 

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Just pay silicon lottery to delid it. It forces them to take liability if something goes wrong. It's slightly more expensive than buying the delidding tool yourself and risking damaging your cpu. Just pay them to do it so you can hold them accountable if anything goes wrong since they offer a free replacement chip if they **** up.

Rockit cool also takes liability if you use their kit and it goes wrong. SL also remounts the IHS so you have to delid it again anyways if you want direct die. I first had SL delid mine and was still seeing temps in the high 90’s so I said **** it got Rockit’s kit and went direct die, now I never go past 64 degrees.

Waste of money to send it to SL

 

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I was unaware that rockit cool offered that! That is huge! I can't argue with that . Kudos to rockit cool for being so consumer friendly A+.

Yep. Check out the second review
https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/collections/9th-gen-cpu/products/rockit-89-i9-9900k-delid-relid-kit

Ignore the 1 star rating, person refused to send in the CPU but still blamed Rockit for the damage.
You have to send in the CPU for them to confirm but they will replace if damaged via their kit

 

So what thermal compound are people going with nowadays for direct die?

 

Hi,
Thermal grizzly liquid metal.

 

That stained my heat spreader last go around. I know direct die + block finish are different than an IHS but I'm now hesitant to use it on anything other than die to underside of IHS's.

 

Yes, worth it. But in my opinion only if you go direct die because only then the gained improvement is substantial enough to take the risk (and lose your warranty)

For a degree or 5... I wouldn't bother, but for the 13 degrees I gained with going direct die with a Noctua D15 it was worth it. CPU's are not typically things that suddenly cause problems (unlike videocards, harddrives, mainboards and memory modules). And I'm more of a 'set-it-and-forget-it' guy that doesn't look for extreme 24/7 overclocks. So I think the risk of my CPU suddenly breaking in the future is very low.

That being said: Going direct die can be just as safe as with a heatspreader, but you need to be VERY precise and careful in how you mount your cooler. Also you must use a support frame with precise thickness. In my case I designed and 3D printed frame similar to the one from RockitCool and Der8auer.

You can download it here:
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4118891

Going direct die is all about evenly distributing the pressure from your cooler. And the best way to do that is when a bit of pressure is applied to the CPU die for good contact and the rest of the pressure is distributed on the PCB that surrounds it. This means A) The underside of your cooler has to be perfectly flat and B) the 3D printed part that covers the PCB area around the CPU die must be the same height as that CPU die. It's all about creating an even surface between CPU die and the surrounding PCB.

In my case I made the 3D print in such a way that the core sits ever so slightly higher (like less then a tenth of a mm) compared to the thickness of the printed frame. This ensures the CPU core makes good contact with the cooler. When the cooler is pressed down firmly, the ever so slightly flex of the PCB the core sits on causes the cooler to distribute the rest of its pressure to the PCB.

I did have to sand down the underside of my Noctua D15 since it was not perfectly flat. Luckely that's very easy. Just get a glass mirror and put some fine grit sandpaper on it. Next, place the cooler on top of it and start working until its flat.

 

For your D15, did you use LM or TIM on the direct die application?

 

So fair warning, if you have a monoblock make sure it's compatible with direct die mounting beforehand. I made the grave mistake of not looking into this before taking on the project. Drained loop, removed motherboard from case, unmounted monoblock, delidded, put everything back together to find that my computer was shutting off immediately after turning it on.

I ended up removing everything again to find that the thermal paste on the die wasn't even touched by the monoblock. :devil:

I ended up having to clean the IHS solder and reuse it with liquid metal between it and the die. Once everything was up and running it turned out due to the heat or whatever I fried my i219-V ethernet controller. Had to replace the board, hence redo everything once again.

PS: Has anyone tried the copper IHS's? Are they a noticeable improvement over stock heat sink delidded + condoctonaut?

 

I delidded my 9900k...I don’t get why people would take a razor blade or a sander to it...you can just use quicksilver.

Anyway I direct die cooled mine. Not a crazy difference, but it was an interesting effort. No detrimental impact.


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I delidded my 9900k...I don’t get why people would take a razor blade or a sander to it...you can just use quicksilver.

I went the LM route to get off the solder as well. A little Fitz polish after and it looked perfect.

I did have an issue with an EK water block after delidding and going direct die. The block would sit on the standoffs and not have the best contact with the die. I would get a few cores spike into the 90c range on fairly light loads. I ended up making my own standoffs with some long M3 screws nuts and washers.

 

IM delidding a soldered 9900K is not worth it. Delid gains roughly 3-4c, and you need about 8c to get 100 MHz

 

Yep. And honestly in my experience so far, no matter how good your interface is, water isn’t gonna be able to buffer the temp spikes after a certain voltage. I have mine set to about 1.285V to hit 5GHz stable with medHigh LLC. My temps go up to the high 70s under non AVX loads. 1.3 was giving me high 80s to low 90s.

If you’re using exotic cooling, then it could help.

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Anyone use the copper IHS Rockit sell? If so any noticeable improvements over stock IHS + delidded + LM?

 

It feels ever so slightly thicker


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