[bigcid10]

Too lazy to grab screenshots from the bios (sorry!). But the settings are as described in my posts. Here are the Zen timings screenie though.

wow!
I thought the speed and latency was good with the nunbers I had set
but those are crazy

I have the same ram set as you
before it was 65-66
now it's 62-63 ,Thanks for the advice

 

[Nighthog]

I have new Memory, but was the victim of chip lottery.

I have now 2x8GB Hynix DJR 17nm & 2x8GB Micron Rev.J 17nm

I was trying out the Hynix DJR kit and was ~4066Mhz XMP stable. Got impatient and plopped inside the other kit, they were Micron Rev.J, what I actually wanted to try.
They had no issue to boot 4066Mhz on first try but wasn't stable at that speed so I went back to stock and seems Ok. I was planning on 4x8GB but different chips will make this a little more hassle than I thought.

Though these seem initially better than my older Micron Rev.E 19nm at first glance.

Which kits are best in the end? My old Micron Rev.E, new Rev.J or the challenger Hynix DJR?

Trouble.

 

[KedarWolf]

Got some more shredding on SATA drives... hope it's not bad.
Failed to check the memory training.

You really have to get in the BIOS and check the BCLK at every change in memory settings.
I had avoided the other day to boot at 106 but today I got distracted and booted with 104.
Guess it's an issue from AMD's AGESA and not from GB but really should be fixed, it's totally shameful.

I've also tried to split VDDG IOD/CCD and again catastrophic failure.
VDDG is constantly forced back to Manual 1050 if set Auto in XFR.
I guess the split value in AMD Overclocking it's not set or doesn't work properly; random reboots and such.

Useful tip: if you set something that will cause instability and load a previous profile often the instability will persist.
You have to issue a Load Optimized Defaults, Save & Reboot, enter in the BIOS and Load the previous profile.
Every know and then I forget it and drive me crazy for a while...

I've settled for these settings for the memory right now, 1.42v:

View attachment 351848

@Veii do you have improvements to suggest?

So far the best results both from CB20 and Sandra MT.

Never mind, I thought you were a 3950x, don't think Blender will compare.

Can you run Blender Classroom?

I want to see if you beat the below, I'm not sure why, but my Cinebench is quite a bit better than yours but my 32Mb SuperPi is much slower. :/

Sub 3.54 Blender Classroom, but that is with all tasks shutdown, and all unnecessary services stopped in Windows 10.

The second is without shutting down tasks and services, only start-up programs disabled in the start-up tab in task manager.

These are NOT benchmarking BIOS settings I'm using, but my settings I run on my PC 24/7. :drum:

I'm afraid to push this CPU to past what I feel is safe as it's on 5nm and I fear I will degrade it trying to push high voltages and high clocks. :h34r-smi

 

[Nighthog]

A little sad to note the Hynix DJR doesn't do better than tRCDRD 21 @ 3800Mhz.

tRCDRD 20 kept giving me lots of trouble and was being a hassle overall. Voltage wasn't doing it up-to 1.45V with passive airflow. Relaxed it back up to 21 and no issues. Was expecting a little more to be honest.

Still yet to test what the Micron Rev.J can do. Will be exploring the DJR first for now.

GeardownMode: Disabled 1T was much easier to boot with the Hynix DJR than Rev.E at least.

 

[ManniX-ITA]

Never mind, I thought you were a 3950x, don't think Blender will compare.

Can you run Blender Classroom?

I want to see if you beat the below, I'm not sure why, but my Cinebench is quite a bit better than yours but my 32Mb SuperPi is much slower. :/

Sub 3.54 Blender Classroom, but that is with all tasks shutdown, and all unnecessary services stopped in Windows 10.

The second is without shutting down tasks and services, only start-up programs disabled in the start-up tab in task manager.

These are NOT benchmarking BIOS settings I'm using, but my settings I run on my PC 24/7. :drum:

I'm afraid to push this CPU to past what I feel is safe as it's on 5nm and I fear I will degrade it trying to push high voltages and high clocks. :h34r-smi

C'mon that's not fair, yours is a 3950x
My 3800x on Classrom does 8:40 under main Windows install...

Those SuperPI scores are from the benching Windows install booting from USB.
Profile is my everyday runner but the install is minimal, faster than light compared to the main one.

I guess if the 32mb is faster there's some memory timing which has a lot of impact, for sure it's not the processor...
I've never compared SuperPI timings so I'm not sure how to relate it.
Guess if Veii is advising its use is cause it's more dependent on memory than cpu.
Time on the main Windows install is 8:28.815 for reference.

A little sad to note the Hynix DJR doesn't do better than tRCDRD 21 @ 3800Mhz.

tRCDRD 20 kept giving me lots of trouble and was being a hassle overall. Voltage wasn't doing it up-to 1.45V with passive airflow. Relaxed it back up to 21 and no issues. Was expecting a little more to be honest.

Still yet to test what the Micron Rev.J can do. Will be exploring the DJR first for now.

GeardownMode: Disabled 1T was much easier to boot with the Hynix DJR than Rev.E at least.

I can't run at all my kit with DJR with Gear Down off.
But I can go with tRCDRD down to 19 and tRCDRW to 16.
Anyhow, compared to much more relaxed settings, very little difference in AIDA and Sandra benchmarks; a bit better results with CB20.

 

[Tsk_Force]

New crash new parameters! the way of 'overclocking is long and uphill, even today the pc has not started, let's try some fixes as suggested by @Veii and @ManniX-ITA

Vddp voltage control manual

vddp voltage control 920

System Memory multiplier 37.33

-Standard timing control

Cas latency 16

tRCDRD 16

tRCDWR 16

tRP 16

tRAS 32--->36

tRC 48

ProcODT 43.6 ohm -->53.3ohm

DRAM voltage 1.38V--->1.42V

VCORE SOC 1.100V

DRAM Termination 0.710V (DRAM voltage/2)

VDDG CCD Voltage control 950

VDDG IOD Voltage control 950

Infinity fabric frequency and dividers 1867mHz

CsOdtDrvStren 24 ohm

RttNom Rtt_Nom Disabled

RttWr Dynamic ODT Off

Gear down mod enabled

L1 Stream HW Prefetcher Enable

L2 Stream HW Prefetcher Enable

Power Down Enabled Disabled


I raised the CsOdtDrvStren as suggested, plus I set the resistance parameters as suggested by the DRAM calculator. Any suggestions?

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[Nighthog]

I can't run at all my kit with DJR with Gear Down off.
But I can go with tRCDRD down to 19 and tRCDRW to 16.
Anyhow, compared to much more relaxed settings, very little difference in AIDA and Sandra benchmarks; a bit better results with CB20.

Seems I might have worse binning on these SR Hynix DJR than your DJR.

tRP@18 blue screens on windows boot up. Though I can run tCL@15 if I do 1.47-1.50V. tCL@15 can't boot with 1.45V but does above, testing at which voltage it's stable.
A mixed bag, not really doing better than the Rev.E @ 3800Mhz on comparable voltage. Better on tRCDRD & tRC but worse on tRP. tCL isn't as good and seems to want more voltage overall.

EDIT: I changed to the Micron Rev.J and they are very similar to the DJR but better?
tRCDRD@21 for 3800Mhz also only stable.
But these do tRP@17 rather than 19-20, the same my Rev.E could do @ 3800Mhz. Still checking.

 

[ManniX-ITA]

New crash new parameters! the way of 'overclocking is long and uphill, even today the pc has not started, let's try some fixes as suggested by @Veii and @ManniX-ITA

Spoiler

Vddp voltage control manual

vddp voltage control 920

System Memory multiplier 37.33

-Standard timing control

Cas latency 16

tRCDRD 16

tRCDWR 16

tRP 16

tRAS 32--->36

tRC 48

ProcODT 43.6 ohm -->53.3ohm

DRAM voltage 1.38V--->1.42V

VCORE SOC 1.100V

DRAM Termination 0.710V (DRAM voltage/2)

VDDG CCD Voltage control 950

VDDG IOD Voltage control 950

Infinity fabric frequency and dividers 1867mHz

CsOdtDrvStren 24 ohm

RttNom Rtt_Nom Disabled

RttWr Dynamic ODT Off

Gear down mod enabled

L1 Stream HW Prefetcher Enable

L2 Stream HW Prefetcher Enable

Power Down Enabled Disabled


I raised the CsOdtDrvStren as suggested, plus I set the resistance parameters as suggested by the DRAM calculator. Any suggestions?

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I still think would be better to set VDDP to 900.

Check this post from Veii about scaling:
https://www.overclock.net/forum/18051-memory/1746444-oc-ing-t-force-4133-cl18.html#post28424814

In my understanding is better to keep 50 mV or 75 mV stepping.

On my Master anything different than 900/950 is unstable at 3600 and above.

If you plug a FAT32 formatted USB stick you can take BIOS screenshots with F12.
Would be much better to understand how's your profile.

 

[Tsk_Force]

I still think would be better to set VDDP to 900.

Check this post from Veii about scaling:
https://www.overclock.net/forum/18051-memory/1746444-oc-ing-t-force-4133-cl18.html#post28424814

In my understanding is better to keep 50 mV or 75 mV stepping.

On my Master anything different than 900/950 is unstable at 3600 and above.

If you plug a FAT32 formatted USB stick you can take BIOS screenshots with F12.
Would be much better to understand how's your profile.

I applied scaling with a + 50mv and +100 to the vsoc

I have bios screens, someone tried to group it so as not to post many images

I hope to see this pc turn on tomorrow morning

 

[ManniX-ITA]

I applied scaling with a + 50mv and +100 to the vsoc

I have bios screens, someone tried to group it so as not to post many images

I hope to see this pc turn on tomorrow morning

I'm not sure it's going to work this way sorry

You can use the SPOILER tag to hide the images.

First, I'd set CPU vCore to Normal, Auto does all kinds of weird things.

For the CAD Bus Strength you should set all the values manually.
Generally, you should input all values manually.
Your RAM clearly has issues at boot in the training phase, every value in Auto is an invite to fail.

Try CAD BUS Strength in this sequence:

24-20-24-24
40-20-24-24
40-20-40-24

Weren't these Samsung b-die?
I think DRAM Calc suggests RTT_WR RZQ/3 and RTT_PARK RZQ/1

Maybe better to download Taiphoon Burner and generate a report.
You should get enough data for a decent DRAM Calc profile.
Input all the timings from the profile on screen and leave Auto only what's missing.

 

[Tsk_Force]

these are the parameters suggested by DRAM calculator [emoji848]

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[pal]

I am running fine my 2x8GB 3000mhz kit @ 3600 with this settings. PD -disable, GD - disable, dram V 1.4, Hynix CJR.

 

[MyUsername]

these are the parameters suggested by DRAM calculator [emoji848]
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You'll need 1.1v for the soc, 1050 might okay for 1800 but 1867 will get a little unstable, 1.075v in windows should be okay. If you adjust soc v and ram, you'll have to adjust procODT up as may get memory errors and become unstable.

How many sticks of RAM have you got?

Here's my RM and calc to if you like.

The calculator's not bad, but vddp and vddg are too high and not enough dram volts, it gets worse at 3800 and even with 4 sticks it horrendously miles out.

 

[Tsk_Force]

I Ve got 2 sticks

if you go up a couple of posts above there are the photos of the BIOS, I'm trying to solve this "cold start" problem


if you have any advice, tell me

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[Nighthog]

I Ve got 2 sticks

if you go up a couple of posts above there are the photos of the BIOS, I'm trying to solve this "cold start" problem


if you have any advice, tell me

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Try the RTT RZQ values first, there might be other combinations than the calculator suggests that work but it's a start.

Set your CAD Bus manually so you know what you use at all times. They have an effect to have correct.

 

[wubbalubbadubdu]

Thanks for this great thread. I've been starting to search around in it, I am hoping someone can confirm the following for me. I want to buy thermal pads to replace the stock pads and plan on re-pasting the chipset too.

vrm thermal pad size on front of board?
vrm thermal pad size on backplate?
thermal paste for chipset, spread or put very large dot?

If I do not purchase >11w/mk pads I will have the same performance? Also, stacking the thermal pads isn't ideal so I should purchase the separate sizes right?

Should I update to latest bios and are there any things a noob like myself will not know to search for that I should learn about this board?

 

[Tsk_Force]

Try the RTT RZQ values first, there might be other combinations than the calculator suggests that work but it's a start.



Set your CAD Bus manually so you know what you use at all times. They have an effect to have correct.

Now i'm trying this on CAD bus setup:

CsOdtDrvStren 24 ohm

ClkDrvStren 24ohm

AddrCmdDrvStren 20ohm

CkeDrvStren 24ohm

RttPark RZQ/5

RttNom Rtt_Nom Disabled

RttWr Dynamic ODT Off



EDIT

I kept the pc off since the last modification made to the BIOS. now I turned it back on and went back to bootloop. now I have entered all the timings that DRAM calculator gave me so I try the various alternatives on the CAD BUS leaving the timings unchanged

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[MyUsername]

I Ve got 2 sticks

if you go up a couple of posts above there are the photos of the BIOS, I'm trying to solve this "cold start" problem


if you have any advice, tell me

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A failed memory training when you get double F9 on the debug causing the bios to reset the IF and memory, one F9 there's something not quite right but it's able to train the memory again and get it running at your selected speed, but it might be unstable. The IF error is 0d, that should just be soc v and/or vddg is too high, unless you have your memory with really tight timings and other crazy values, then this can wipe your cmos and profiles which I've seen on mine.

It's just trying to find the right balance of volts with the resistance between the imc and memory and vice versa to get a clean signal with the correct signal strength, and then find the absolute tightest timings.

A cold start problem could be one or a combination of settings that are slightly too high or low.

vddp may need adjusting 50mV as moving this can get around memory holes which can be caused by changing memory speed or even just adjusting procODT a little, but 900mV should okay if you keep dram volts and procODT at sensible values. This usually causes one F9 training error but can also completely fail.

Not enough dram volts, simple, keep adding until it boots.

SoC is under volts and it's unstable, increase LLC until it boots, turbo should be enough for 1900 with 1.094-1.118v in windows. 1900 IF needs a stable 1.1v in windows, 1867 needs 1.075v and 1800 1050v

Memory timings could be wrong, this can be down to changing one or multiple. A lot of subtimings can be on auto, all you need to change is the primary timings to get started. Once you find that, you can improve latency and bandwidth with the subtimings.

vddg is to low, but really 950 will work at 1867 and 1000 should be the maximum. Going too high 1050 and above causes weird problems.

A lot of have gone through cold boot failing training, even when we think it's stable the occasional F9 pops up and you need a minor tweak.

 

[ryouiki]

I Ve got 2 sticks

if you go up a couple of posts above there are the photos of the BIOS, I'm trying to solve this "cold start" problem


if you have any advice, tell me

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This is 4266C19 Trident Royal Silver?

First thing if you haven't already done it and you are on a X570 Master switch the board to single BIOS mode (left dip switch up, right dip switch down), and validate the BIOS version running on the primary BIOS chip. Having dual BIOS active during memory tweaking is a nightmare... especially if you don't have them both flashed to the same version / don't have a profile saved to USB to reload on failure.

Have you been able to run at all stable @ 3600? Supposedly not all Zen2 chips are even capable of more then 1800 FCLK, so 1866/1900 may not be possible for your specific chip.

Beyond 3600 is mostly time and some luck... for example on the 4 B-Die kits I have, I just leave VSOC to "normal" (1.1) and VDDP/VDDG to defaults (900 / 1050), and that works fine for my 3900x + memory up to 3733CL16. The primary reason I've had boot issues was the RTT values from DRAM calculator... it will hang randomly on both cold/warm boot with RTTNOM = Disabled and RTTWR = Dynamic ODT off, but seems very happy with NOM: RZQ/7, WR: RZQ/3, PARK: RZQ/1 on both 2x8 and 4x8 configurations.

That said, there are so many variables in memory tuning that if you ask 100 people, you'll probably get 100 different answers about what should work. Even if they have identical memory to you, their settings might not work... I have 2 kits of FlareX 3200CL14 sitting here, but they are manufactured 2 years apart and have different PCB layouts/behavior in this board.

 

[Tsk_Force]

This is 4266C19 Trident Royal Silver?



First thing if you haven't already done it and you are on a X570 Master switch the board to single BIOS mode (left dip switch up, right dip switch down), and validate the BIOS version running on the primary BIOS chip. Having dual BIOS active during memory tweaking is a nightmare... especially if you don't have them both flashed to the same version / don't have a profile saved to USB to reload on failure.



Have you been able to run at all stable @ 3600? Supposedly not all Zen2 chips are even capable of more then 1800 FCLK, so 1866/1900 may not be possible for your specific chip.



Beyond 3600 is mostly time and some luck... for example on the 4 B-Die kits I have, I just leave VSOC to "normal" (1.1) and VDDP/VDDG to defaults (900 / 1050), and that works fine for my 3900x + memory up to 3733CL16. The primary reason I've had boot issues was the RTT values from DRAM calculator... it will hang randomly on both cold/warm boot with RTTNOM = Disabled and RTTWR = Dynamic ODT off, but seems very happy with NOM: RZQ/7, WR: RZQ/3, PARK: RZQ/1 on both 2x8 and 4x8 configurations.



That said, there are so many variables in memory tuning that if you ask 100 people, you'll probably get 100 different answers about what should work. Even if they have identical memory to you, their settings might not work... I have 2 kits of FlareX 3200CL14 sitting here, but they are manufactured 2 years apart and have different PCB layouts/behavior in this board.

Yea, trident royal silver

tomorrow I fix the BIOS on my own and I try to save the profile on a USB. you say to try first on 3600/1800? surely I have some problems between procODT and CAD BUS, putting the RAM in xmp the coold boot was rarer, with the parameters that I am setting I the cold boot has become a fixed appointment.
these are the first tests that I do of overclocking, the only stable thing that I have found so far is the profile at 2333 that puts the BIOS after it resets [emoji23]

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